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#EP27 David Illingworth

Listen to David’s story

This week Ben is joined by structural engineer and co-founder of the London Structures Lab, David Illingworth. Ben and David discuss all things structural engineering, sustainability, interdisciplinary architecture, as well as what its like to start your own company.

 

Listen to this episode from Create More Podcast by Ben Stuart on Spotify. On episode 27 of the create more podcast Ben heads of to London Structure's Lab in South East London to talk to the co-founder David Illingworth.They talk about a whole range of topics, from what's it like start a business, how to be creative in all parts of the design world, the benefits of teaching and loads more.

 

David Illingworth, a passionate structural engineer, has worked on a whole range of fascinating projects. “My backgrounds really nicely varied, I’ve been on site in the Middle East doing a tower with Cesar Pelli, which I think was about three metres taller than the Shard. I was then seconded to Fosters, the whole team was effectively moved down to Fosters, and we did four railway stations in Saudi – mega, mega projects - and then we did 5 Broadgate - not exactly a small building! But I was like I really enjoy doing the smaller projects - the craft of the smaller jobs. Although you can find those interesting bits in all the big projects - like the stability system or there's the complexities that we did on 5 Broadgate - some fantastic work. I also really enjoyed doing the detailing for the lift shaft. I did a job at Norwich Cathedral where we laminated oak with stainless steel and we glued it together – we didn’t use screws. That’s one detail that changes how we're going to do the whole of the building”.

Following a recommendation from a teacher, David studied civil and structural engineering at the University of Sheffield. “I did engineering because my maths teacher said “don't do pure maths”, I was like “why?” and he goes “do applied maths” and I was like “what’s that?” and he said “its engineering!”. So I went and I looked at mechanical engineering and that looked a really dull, so I looked at structural engineering I thought “okay that looks alright I'll give that a go”. I probably thought I was going to become an accountant, in fact I had a wobble - I did the degree and really enjoyed it because it's is a really varied degree right, you've got your pure maths and you've got all your different materials and structures and hydraulics and all that and they're all different and if you're not enjoying one you've got another five that you find interesting”.

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“I really enjoy doing the smaller projects - the craft of the smaller jobs. Although you can find those interesting bits in all the big projects - like the stability system or there's the complexities that we did on 5 Broadgate - some fantastic work”

In 2019, David formed his own practice, London Structures Lab, with friends Ed Moseley and John Risley. “Two of us handed our notice in together, I think [our boss] joked actually, “you're not resigning, are you?” and I said, “yeah we are”. I think we had joked about resigning, but you know it was surprisingly quick, it was in the pub, sat down and you would talk about it and suddenly it got more serious. You look at all logic at the path that you could take from that moment forward - and you realise one is just way more fun. We were lucky, we just so had people that said “oh yeah you might be right for this” and off we went. I think we've all performed consistently throughout our careers and helped people and that's really one thing that's been remarkable is that so many people have been so generous and nice to us”.

As well as working as a structural engineer at the London Structures Lab, David also tutors students at the prestigious Architectural Association. “When I started my first job, I knew nothing about architecture, I literally didn't know what they do. I've had no training in design in anyway at all. I've been trained in Sheffield with maths, applied maths, and a bit more applied maths that was it you know. I think in a lot of ways that was right because they weren't training people to be specific anything, so they gave you a good background. If you look at everybody that's come out of it have all gone off and done different things and to actually design would have been a bit pointless. I like forcing myself to think naively and I think that's important and that's come from teaching at the AA. You realise that actually naivety is incredibly creative”.

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“I like forcing myself to think naively - I think that's important and that's come from teaching at the AA. You realise that actually naivety is incredibly creative”

David is a keen believer in interdisciplinary design and wider collaborative approaches to architecture. “I think you (an architect) could ask me (a structural engineer) – “can I do this?” - I could just say “yes or no”. That seems to be a very common approach to design but actually what I need to know is why you are asking the question because I know that you don't know as much about structural engineering as I do - because I wouldn't be in a job. So, I need to then go well if that person knew everything I know about this building - would he ask a different question. So I always teach people that work with me - always answer the question, answer it as well as you can but also then think about what the question could have been or should have been. Answer that as well, so you offer “yes the beam is this big but actually if we do these three things then we can create this” and I think that's part of this process of empathising with each other”.

Since the creation of the London Structures Lab, David has been able to work across numerous stages of construction. “I think at very large organisations you have to play your part in the ‘bigger beast’, you stop doing some of the stuff you wanted to do. I like the concept stage but I also like going on site. I've been out today looking around a building that we're trying to put another few floors on top without changing much - I wanna do that site visit and I want to see it through to construction. I can't see how I can be useful round that first meeting table for very long if I don't know how to build it. I think you’ve got to have that understanding to be useful and then you should also know the cutting edge technology, you should know the latest academic research. So effectively that's what we bring together - everyone at London Structures Lab can be incredibly useful in that first meeting”.

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“Really, the aim is to build long term collaborations where we can feel that we've been really instrumental in the success of the architect, the client, and the MEP team”

 

Sustainability is vitally important to David and the London Structures lab. “I think there should be a sort of a mindset change to an extent - if we build anything it does have to be perform well, it has to encourage the users to be as successful as possible at whatever they are trying to do and there's been some good research about that. I think UCL did some research about how they were teaching people and they learnt quite quickly that they can't teach people when they're asleep - and so they realised that what's happening is they were using their rooms wrong, and they were heating up loaded CO2, they come back after a big lunch, turn the lights out, everybody falls asleep. I say it because we need all those spaces to perform well to their current use - but it's only their current use and it will change in the future. So do you design it to be this really robust baggy structure or do you make part of the structure adaptable so it becomes part of your fit out and you can respond to it. The car industry has changed, the fact that you rent a car - so they get it back - so suddenly they're really encouraged to design it for the recovery of things. I hope the façade industry is the first to do that - we specify the facade and performance and its attached to the building. You rent it for 25 years - if you want to keep it - you have to keep renting or you send it back - and they recover it”.

David and the London Structures Lab have been working successfully for just over a year and they are very keen to continue that progression. “ Really, the aim is to build long term collaborations where we can feel that we've been really instrumental in the success of the architect, the client, and the MEP people. I believe in single discipline companies a lot, my overall course at the AA is called ‘creative conflicts’ – its to say that you need to conflict and have differing opinions in order to be creative. You have to have mutual respect but ultimately, I work for the client and the client is trying to create something with a need and I want to do that and I will support the architect in doing that as well as we can”.

Thank you to David for taking time to speak to us about the London Structures Lab’s story. Check out their website here.

Ben Stuart • Joseph Caden • Create More • 2021

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#EP26 JUSTIN NICHOLLS